Convince Me #1Posted 4 years Ago

At 7/4/2017 9:50:14 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
Well let's go ask every single person in the world if you should believe in Jesus or not. This should be more convincing then asking just one or two .

I am asking people to give me reasons, to convince me. I do not care how many people believe it to be so, because they could all be wrong.

We will cover the globe. We can't just ask the people around us . We will ask everyone from everywhere from all walks of life .

OK . Can everyone that believes in Jesus , Raise there hands please.

2.2 billion Christianschool 31.50%
1.6 billion Muslims. 22.32%
14 million Judaism. 0.20%

We will use the law of numbers.
And the majority rules factor.
54% of the world say you should believe in Jesus.
If you don't know yourself ,
Of course you should take the 54% odds everyday of the week.

So, just a giant argumentum ad populum fallacy?

I said I am open minded about these things, not that I will believe anything for any reason.
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Convince Me #1Posted 4 years Ago

At 7/4/2017 6:31:02 PM, Geogeer wrote:


Sorry busy right now... video is all I have time for...

This video seems to be about the Resurrection of Jesus, and so I feel like it will presuppose that Jesus existed.

1) I have never actually seen a study that shows that the vast majority of scholars believe in the empty tomb, or even just a majority. If there is one, I would love to see it as well as information on who was polled (as there exist quite a few scholars of theology who presuppose certain aspects of the bible instead of reaching those aspects as conclusions).

Furthermore, there is a view that is gaining quite a bit of traction among scholars, and a view which I actually hold, that there wasn't even a tomb.

Roman Law, as outlined by Josephus and many others (I don't have a reference for this saved on my computer, but I can find one if you would like), would have it so a person who was crucified would not be allowed to be buried in a tomb. If they were buried at all it would be in a common burial pit.

Jewish Law, as outlined in the Mishnah Sanhedrin 6:5, Babylonian Talmud Sanhedrin 47a, and Tosefta Sanhedrin 9.7-8d would have it so a blasphemer would not be allowed an honorable burial, but would be buried in a pit.

The Secret Gospel of James actually seems to preserve this view as it says, depending on translation, that Jesus was either buried in the sand or buried shamefully, which would be the same thing in that instance anyways.

2) But the predominant view, from what I understand (my classes, reading, etc.) is that it was seeing Jesus almost no different than people see Elvis. People swear they see Elvis alive, walking around, etc., despite also being buried. So a bodily appearance of Jesus could happen all the while the tomb not being empty.

Furthermore, he simply says that a skeptical scholar says that the risen Jesus appeared to his followers. Doesn't name a name so it can be fact checked, and it doesn't mean that it was actually Jesus, just that the followers saw Jesus. You can see things that are not actually there. And it doesn't mean the scholar was right.

Pausing the video at 9:20 and will continue later.
I would, however, like it better if you didn't just link a long video and instead engaged more on a person to person level.
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Convince Me #1Posted 4 years Ago

At 7/4/2017 7:01:53 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 7/4/2017 5:46:38 PM, SNP1 wrote:
Convince me that Jesus existed as a historical figure.

If Bible is not enough to convince you, I think nothing will be. But I would like to know, why you want to be convinced?

I want to be as close to correct with my views as possible.
Convince Me threads are a great way for people to argue their perspective and what they think is the most convincing evidence for something.
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Convince Me #1Posted 4 years Ago

At 7/4/2017 5:50:53 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
If Jesus didn't exist, we wouldn't have Hot cross Buns.

Damn, I never considered the Hot cross Buns.
What a fool I am.
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Convince Me #1Posted 4 years Ago

I am a few days later than I intended (intended for this to be posted on the 1st).

Hello everyone, it has been quite some time since I have been on this site.
I am entirely open minded to the possibility that there is a god, that there is not one, that the supernatural is real, that it isn't, etc.

I will post a new "Convince Me" on the 1st of each month (depending on how well they do).

For this one, one related to the field in which I study the most, history, specifically early Christian history.

Convince me that Jesus existed as a historical figure.

You do NOT need to convince me that he was a prophet, messiah, etc., only that he actually existed.

I look forward to the discussions in this thread, and to everyone, have a good day.
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The gnostic gospelsPosted 5 years Ago

At 4/29/2017 4:46:43 AM, uncung wrote:
At 4/29/2017 4:15:56 AM, janesix wrote:
At 4/29/2017 4:06:28 AM, uncung wrote:
At 4/29/2017 3:44:06 AM, janesix wrote:
Christians, have you ever read the nag hammadi texts pertaining to Jesus?

What do you think of them?

they don't accept it since it was existed 100-200 years after Jesus gone.

I read they were dated to 4 ad

No. There were no the alleged Gnostic books or documents that dated to 4 ad. if they were 4 ad then they would not be considered as Gnostic texts.

Not necessarily. There are quite a few scholars that think Sethian Gnosticism, a version of Jewish Gnosticism, existed in the 1st century BCE.

The main issue is that the texts that we actually have do not date nearly that early.
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The gnostic gospelsPosted 5 years Ago

At 4/29/2017 4:15:56 AM, janesix wrote:
At 4/29/2017 4:06:28 AM, uncung wrote:
At 4/29/2017 3:44:06 AM, janesix wrote:
Christians, have you ever read the nag hammadi texts pertaining to Jesus?

What do you think of them?

they don't accept it since it was existed 100-200 years after Jesus gone.

I read they were dated to 4 ad

Sorry, but there isn't a single scholar out there that dates the Gnostic texts we have to 4 ad.

The gnostic texts we have are 2nd century, MAYBE really late 1st century (though there are very few scholars that think this).
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History forum revivalPosted 5 years Ago

At 4/28/2017 11:13:57 PM, The-Voice-of-Truth wrote:
At 4/28/2017 9:46:10 PM, mc9 wrote:
I feel as though the history forum has a lot of potential who else wants to help this revival?

1. VoT
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.

this is not the first time this was attempted lol. unfortunately it died out last time.

I think the difficult thing is finding enough people interested in the same periods of history. If everyone is interested in different times/places, then it becomes harder for discussions to happen.
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History forum revivalPosted 5 years Ago

At 4/28/2017 11:17:49 PM, mc9 wrote:
At 4/28/2017 11:12:57 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 4/28/2017 9:46:23 PM, mc9 wrote:
At 4/28/2017 9:46:10 PM, mc9 wrote:
I feel as though the history forum has a lot of potential who else wants to help this revival?

1.mc9
2.SNP1
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.

Sadly, I only really enjoy discussing history of early Christianity and occasionally Judaism, so I don't know how helpful I would be...

That's cool, it's a very interesting topic, I think it's interesting how
Christianity came to be so prominent

While that is interesting, I find the rise and interaction between different sects to be MUCH more interesting. I focus my studies as much as possible on the first two centuries as they are vastly interesting, especially the gnostics.
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History forum revivalPosted 5 years Ago

At 4/28/2017 9:46:23 PM, mc9 wrote:
At 4/28/2017 9:46:10 PM, mc9 wrote:
I feel as though the history forum has a lot of potential who else wants to help this revival?

1.mc9
2.SNP1
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.

Sadly, I only really enjoy discussing history of early Christianity and occasionally Judaism, so I don't know how helpful I would be...
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