The Instigator
anc2006
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
Leaning
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Atheism is more free than Christians

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/6/2020 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 316 times Debate No: 123981
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (5)
Votes (0)

 

anc2006

Pro

Imagine sitting on your ankles, Giving up your side hustle just to recite a poem from an outdated book written 2000 years ago, Just to ask for something that is essentially a make-a-believe statement that you can hope for and expect but nothing else.

Imagine taking your space of brain giving up how to ultra-memorize the 30, 000th digits of pi, Just to memorize a book of an old lunatic that is never proven if it is fiction or not.

Imagine not trusting science just for that unproven god of yours. Imagine not trusting how earth is made confirmed by NASA with plenty of geological data, Just to think that God created the sun after the earth and that the universe was literally solid at one point after the big bang, And that earth is the center of the universe, And that aliens doesn't ever exist.

Imagine using completely non-factual faith just to trade off of fair-and-square atheistic science.

This is a life of christian, Really. Either way, Forget about the bible. It is just a brainwasher that spreads false information.
Leaning

Con

Poetry can be beautiful and enlightening.

There's times in life where you feel no respite
Stress, Worry, Leading to melancholy
Environments causation
Depressants entitlement
Oh, But even a free will denier
Or refuter of life hereafter
Can still dare pray, Hope
That we were made strong
Enough to but try

Not from the Bible, But what's wrong with poetry?
In the general sense I mean,
What's there to disavow in hope and healing?
History and lessons?
Which I assert without giving evidence yet, The Bible contains.
Even if it were fiction, Which I'll not say yet.

Memorization exercises the brain, I'd assume.
More than that, I repeat again, History and lessons.

Christianity does not automatically mean not trusting science.
Was Gregor Mendel not a Catholic, Who helped usher in an age of genetics?
Are there not many branches of Christianity, Many individuals who view it in their own fashions?
Those who preach allegory?
Those who preach an Earth confirmed by NASA, Though of intelligent design?

To place faith, To me, Seems quite human.
In an atheist or a Christian.

For round 1 I argue atheism is not more or less free than Christianity.
Though I may change tact in round 2.
Debate Round No. 1
anc2006

Pro

Well I think atheists have more of a space to think of their own. They can create their own rationale used for themselves. But Christianity? Well, You are sacrificing yourself to something that just give some vague morals and nothing else, While being literally unproven.

The bible is ordered in stories, Poems, And articles. OK What kind of mindless lunatic thought that this was a good idea? The most important part of religion is explainable facts and aligned morals. Great in stories, Which one is it? Oh yeah, NOTHING? It might be both, But it is too inefficient. Might as well be the story too abstract you need people added inside it instead of just having the full blown laws of physics copied inside it.

Imagine you reciting a part of the Psalms just to ask help to some entity that is first unproven and second by definition can help all of us without doubt nor need of prayers.

I know, That faith is not bad, But the faith of the bible is so old that you just feel like you are being enslaved by a 2000 year old being that knows less science than you according to how the bible was written that people doubted even Bible agreeing with science.

Everything you learned in the bible is inside 2 categories:
1) Agreeing with science, Which you can learn in a non-catholic school
2) Does not agree with science, Which you don't even need to learn

So according to this, Filter out the false from the truth, The entire bible is just a historical fiction. And what kind of cult would use a historical fiction with 66 volumes to control morality of the country? The Christians? Anyone else? Judaism? All the other religions?

Might as well take the bible part of my brain away and throw it with trash and replace it with, Like how to survive in the woods. Praying not to fall into the woods may just let you panic inside the woods. Prayers rarely work, And in case if "god" saw it to happen in the future to be done, Why doesn't he help automatically? Because this figure is just fictional.
Leaning

Con

Christians create their own rationale as well, How else could there exist so many different interpretations?
What's a sacrifice, But a trade?
Hardly anything 'inherently wrong with sacrificing oneself, We do it all the time, Be it our time, Health, Money, Attention.
'Just vague morals though?
That I assert is an unfair depiction of Christianity.
In which frequently is found love, Support, Meaning, Morality, Ethics, Kindness, Comfort, Community, Security, Peace, Health, Many other perks I assume.
Admittedly this can be turned on it's head, But so too can this occur with atheism.
Christianity and Atheism are often enough tools or calibrated ends, That their nature depends on those who use or seek them.
Hm, Also I return to the vague morals claim.
Unless one had a specific example for everything, Laws on morals are going to have moments where we must exercise our own judgement.
This does not however make them 'vague I argue. Else they would be such as 'maybe you shouldn't steal, Rather than, Thou shalt not steal.
We have plenty of human laws that assert orders, Yet in which scenarios might arise in which a person is better off not following them, I still wouldn't call that vague.

Stories, Poems, And Articles have 'long been a method of humans passing knowledge.

I never felt I was being enclaved by a 2000 year old being that knew less science than I.
Sounds a subjective interpretation.

Most of what I remember learning in the Bible had to do with history, Allegory, Practical lessons, And moral lessons.

'Just historical fiction?
Eh, Depends on who reads it.
Whether it is only that I mean, Or something different, 'or more.
Sometimes people like to influence people, Sure. Positively, Negatively, Neutrally.
Pretty much 'any society writes history you know?
And that history is often portrayed a bit differently depending on what society is writing it.
No need to go on theatrics and hysterics about the written word.

Throw that part of your brain away?
If you choose, That 'is your prerogative,
As a 'human.

And here I'll try to bring the conversation back toward 'freedom, Which this debate was supposedly about.
Though I saw little of it in your second round.
Though I enjoyed reading and replying well enough.
Anyway.
Freedom.
Atheism can be imposed upon others, As can be seen in some totalitarian regimes in history,
Same with Christianity.
Other times they can be offered instead as a choice,
I again assert them to be more or less equal in freedom.
Whether one believes in God or not, One's freedom is limited by themselves, The world in which they believe themselves to be inhabitants, And said other inhabitants.
Debate Round No. 2
anc2006

Pro

So I am short on time and I am going to do a brief one.

1. Christianity has equal values of knowledge than atheism, But atheists can live whatever they want because a god is not watching over them, And their value is represented on their own, And not like, Serving the god.

2. Christianity has old rules that has worn out by the new ideas. Christians now are taught to do things the way they do 2, 000 years ago. Many factors are neglected because the people in 1st AD had no access to gaming mouses nor space shuttles.
Following a word of god that is supposed to be reliable, But never updates according to situation, If the situation was new and uncovered by the bible, The christians are taught do do thing the old way and not the new, Thus being locked in the state of conservatism and unable to go out unless it means to disobey the bible.

This includes, Homosexuality and other LGBTQ actions, Woman's rights, Slavery, Etc. These are ridiculous in today's democratic nation, But in 2000 years ago they are normal to be discriminated.

3. There are not 2, But 3 types of information in the bible:
1) Proven, Which can also be found in atheistic magazines and non-christian sources to believe in.
2) Unproven, In which it is the same to believe in it or not.
3) Disproven, In which it is better to NOT believe in it.

So far, Everything that is true about the bible can be found in other sources. And if you are a christian, These unproven and disproven information is also a part of your life. Atheists can just neglect the disproven, Thus making more time to studying about other things. Also, Prayers, Which is most likely unproven, Are a wastage of time as that a person with no god can perfectly live good, And prayers are basically made-believe.
Leaning

Con

It's not as though believing in God and Christ, Removes choice from people.
Not even when people formally declare their intention to follow Christian beliefs.

Sure Christians are taught some age old values,
Many people, Even atheists acknowledge that some values are more objectively desirable to humans than others.
And thus are able to last thousands of years as valuable lessons and laws.

Religions and interpretations of religions 'do change over the years.
With the people, Technology, Culture, Society, And such.

This includes, Homosexuality and other LGBTQ actions, Woman's rights, Slavery, Etc. These are ridiculous in today's democratic nation, But in 2000 years ago they are normal to be discriminated.
Hm, Pretty sure that's a gross mischaracterization of Christianity.

Depending on which classification system one uses, That are a great number of various types of information in the Bible.
How is it relevant to freedom?
Christianity, Is simply another way of viewing existence,
It's codes another set of laws to follow in said existence.
Simply rejecting one viewpoint and or set of laws does not make a person free.
For as long as we live, There are viewpoints and rules, If not laws of physics.
An American citizen is more free than an American prisoner, Most would say.
But a Christian is not a prisoner.
Atheism, Itself, Many would say, Is no more than a lack of belief in God, Or an intentional disbelief.
Yet that does not make him 'more free automatically.
For of atheists, There are many stripes and circumstance.

Person A "So can I choose to be a Christian? "
Person B "Not, If you want to be free, The only 'free choice, Is to be an atheist. "
Person A "The 'only free choice? "
Person B "Yes. "
Person A ". . . "
Debate Round No. 3
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by Leaning 1 year ago
Leaning
To deliberately misquote Game of Thrones
Freedom resides where men believe it resides.
Posted by Leaning 1 year ago
Leaning
Ah, I missed responding to your prayer comment in round 2.
Eh, There's a lot of different views on the purpose of prayer.
Posted by Leaning 1 year ago
Leaning
Inherit the Wind scene, Creationism vs. Evolution
Watched it.
Posted by backwardseden 1 year ago
backwardseden
@Leaning
https://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=vtNdYsoool8
@anc2006 - You're getting it, If not gotten it. Congrats. Have you seen Inherit the Wind? If not, Do you get Amazon Prime? You can watch the film there. Or you can watch the remake on youtube but it's not nearly as good. . .
https://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=NYCfo4hVolQ
This will appeal not only for this debate but for your genesis debate also which is 100% correct.
Posted by Leaning 1 year ago
Leaning
Darn, I near always forget about how the profile picture pushes words like that. Ruins the aesthetic of the poem, A bit for me.
No votes have been placed for this debate.

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