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The Instigator
Pro (for)
Anonymous
The Contender
bheicklen
Con (against)

Capitalism is better than Socialism Change my Mind

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Debate Round Forfeited
bheicklen has forfeited round #3.
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/27/2019 Category: Economics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 595 times Debate No: 121053
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (20)
Votes (0)

 

Pro

let's be civil.
bheicklen

Con

To begin, I'm not a supporter of state socialism. The USSR, Venezuela, And Cuba have shown the problems with that system. Instead, I propose more of a democratic socialist standpoint.

1. I am not opposed to capitalism. In fact, I believe that free markets, Voluntary exchange, And capital accumulation help society but those systems can become corrupt without state intervention. If people were left entirely to their own devices, Then the people at the top would oppress the people at the bottom to maintain their positions. They would pay exploit people's labor to maximize profits. I'm not suggesting CEO's don't incur more risk, But people should at least be paid a living wage. If they aren't, Then they can't even afford to buy the products the companies are selling. State intervention allows consequences to those people at the top, And though it is still somewhat corrupt today, It is better than the alternative.

2. The United States discriminated against specific minorities in the past. This made voluntary exchange coerced and opportunities for the future limited. Economically speaking, African-Americans are still recovering from Jim Crow laws. In order to help facilitate social mobility, We should invest resources into welfare programs. Though some people will surely abuse the system, There will be others who use it properly and I don't believe those who abuse it justify the system itself as worthless. I think those people instead should be punished.

3. (Expansion of 2) I believe programs should be created to keep kids from lower income areas in high school. Only 2% of people who graduated high school, Got a full time job, And waited until 21 to get married and children stayed in poverty. Yet, 30% of African Americans and 17% of Hispanics don't graduate high school (Pew research). I suggest taking a small portion from the $600 billion spent on the military to fund these programs. If people decide at some point not to use them, Then the money can be taken out and used elsewhere.

4. Lastly, Capitalism will exploit natural resources without consideration for future generations. Profit over social good leads to a depletion of resources which leads to social strife.

I think this is at least a decent place to start.
Debate Round No. 1

Pro

Instead of welfare we need to have public education tax only occur for those going to public schools. Because according to evidence private schools are better without public education tax.

"Private schools are more cost-effective than government schools and are financially sustainable. Private schools, The evidence shows, Have lower cost of education delivery than government schools; in combination with their higher quality levels this would suggest greater cost effectiveness. Using the proxy measure of length of operation of private schools, Private schools are very clearly financially sustainable. Even stronger circumstantial evidence comes from the vast number of private schools: so many educational entrepreneurs would not be entering these markets if they did not believe the schools to be financially sustainable "

"Some evidence indicates variation in the relative performance of private school pupils in different subject areas. Kingdon (2008) concludes that private unaided schools are 27 percent more effective than private aided schools in their mathematics teaching in Uttar Pradesh. Using data from Andhra Pradesh, Singh and Sarkar (2012) similarly find a private school advantage in mathematics (though attainment was still lower than expected). Notably, However, In Kingdon"s analysis (2008), All three school types studied (government, Private aided and private unaided) were equally effective in imparting reading skills"

"By contrast, Emerging work by Muralidharan and Sundararaman (2013) reports that children in private schools in Andhra Pradesh are performing better in English and Hindi, And no worse in mathematics and Telugu. This is in spite of the fact that 40 percent less instruction time is dedicated to these subjects in private than in government schools (Muralidharan and Sundararama"

They are also shows to be less sexist

""Private schools may mitigate gender differences " if private schools fulfil differentiated demand (e. G. , Provide local schools so that girls do not have to travel far or provide separate toilets for girls and boys), Availability of private schools will increase girls" access to schooling and learning and thus reduce the gender gap in literacy"

Research study on private vs public education
https://assets. Publishing. Service. Gov. Uk/media/5b76ab24ed915d14e1fe34b1/K4D_HDR_Basic_Education_and_Employment. Pdf
bheicklen

Con

What constitutes private school differs around the world, So I will stick with the United States private schooling system. They show the following statistics:

1. 87% of parents with more than $75, 000 choose public over private school. Why? Average tuition for all private school levels in 2011 was $10, 740. Of the 13% who attended, Less than 6% of those students came from families who made less than $50, 000 compared to 26% of the students whose families made $200, 000 or more. The majority of people who polled were from middle to upper class status. These schools aren't being distributed equally. They are being segregated to middle-upper class areas, So they can make money. Every statistic on the Education Next website shows the large population disparity of lower income to upper class.

2. Private schools are incomparable to public education quality.
- They have less students.
- Since they have typically less "serious problems" and better benefits, More qualified teachers are willing to take a pay cut to teach there. Private school teachers are twice as likely to have PHDs.
-They are allowed an extra hour of school for religious purposes which could increase their literacy rates.
-Their teaching methods are not restricted by the federal and state curriculums.

So either people of lower SES students should be afforded more opportunities for private school or programs should be funded to improve the quality of public schools. To address your "public education" tax you propose, It doesn't seem different from a welfare program. Money is money, However, You choose to gather it. After it is gathered, It can be distributed directly to the public schools whether it comes from the tax or a welfare program.

(http://www. Capenet. Org/facts. Html)
(https://www. Citylab. Com/equity/2014/08/where-private-school-enrollment-is-highest-and-lowest-across-the-us/375993/)
(https://www. Educationnext. Org/who-goes-private-school-long-term-enrollment-trends-family-income/)
(https://www. Theatlantic. Com/education/archive/2013/10/why-are-private-school-teachers-paid-less-than-public-school-teachers/280829/)
Debate Round No. 2

Pro

First of all the national average is not accurate. It varies a lot for different states. States with higher minimum wage have higher average private tuition cost. The statistic you provided does not adjust for individual state inflation. I said earlier it would be affordable to go to private school if you did not pay taxes for a school you do not go to. You could also get a scholarship.

https://www. Minimum-wage. Org/wage-by-state
https://www. Privateschoolreview. Com/tuition-stats/private-school-cost-by-state
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Debate Round No. 3
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Debate Round No. 4
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Debate Round No. 5
20 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by SickInTheHeadz 3 years ago
SickInTheHeadz
"North Koreans are still unhealthy as we have pictures and we found extreme sickness in the defected North Korean soldier and accounts of other North Koreans"
North Korean food production is now at 4. 7 million tonnes of food per year. And that's just grain. There is also animal food production and hunting, Which has unknown levels of production. Knowing that North Korea has 25 million population, It is clear that every person gets over 200 kilos of food per year, Which makes it impossible that anyone is dying from hunger or experiencing much hunger, Unless the food isn't properly distributed. Also, North Korea imports food too, So that adds up to the number.

Now, Of course, If you are going to believe in U. S. Propaganda and pics that were taken 10 years ago, Then yeah, At this point there is no way to persuade you.

Also, Defected North Korean soldier maybe had sickness, But then again, People in the U. S. Have sickness too, All the time, And are sometimes unable to afford health insurance, And sometimes they die because of that reason.

North Korea is still safer by murder rate and the amount of people in prison.
Not to mention that North Korean prisons are just as bad as U. S. Prisons, Where you can get raped and beaten in prison in U. S. Just like there are similar reports from North Korean prisons.

Now, I may have gone off topic because U. S. Might not be the actual representation of capitalism, And North Korea is far from actual definition of socialism. Other than calling themselves capitalist and socialist, I really have nothing more to work with.

But nations like Sweden, Switzerland, Japan, And Norway are the real standards of safe countries, And they all have some government interference and regulations. I can hardly find an example of a free capitalist country that is safe and works well and doesn't have much of government regulations.

I especially liked the policy in Switzerland, Where they gave their working people extra money from the gover
Posted by DeletedUser 3 years ago
DeletedUser
It won't let me post argument
Posted by billsands 3 years ago
billsands
the nordic version of capitalism/social democracy seems to be a compromise and incorporates positive aspects of capitalsim and positive aspects of social ism
Posted by DeletedUser 3 years ago
DeletedUser
The page was lagging and I pressed comment several times. Opps.
Posted by DeletedUser 3 years ago
DeletedUser
WTH stupid comment glitch
Posted by DeletedUser 3 years ago
DeletedUser
Many struggle under any system. No political system is perfect and there never will be.
Posted by DeletedUser 3 years ago
DeletedUser
Many struggle under any system. No political system is perfect and there never will be.
Posted by DeletedUser 3 years ago
DeletedUser
Many struggle under any system. No political system is perfect and there never will be.
Posted by DeletedUser 3 years ago
DeletedUser
Many struggle under any system. No political system is perfect and there never will be.
Posted by DeletedUser 3 years ago
DeletedUser
Many struggle under any system. No political system is perfect and there never will be.
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