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The Instigator
anc2006
Pro (for)
The Contender
screenjack
Con (against)

Feminism

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Debate Round Forfeited
anc2006 has forfeited round #3.
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Time Remaining
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/4/2019 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 627 times Debate No: 121668
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (25)
Votes (0)

 

anc2006

Pro

i'm leaving the high ground to my opponent. You can start here.

no misogynists allowed in this, Nor misandrists.

Strictly, No misanthropists like SickInTheHeadz here.
screenjack

Con

What is your definition of Feminism?
Debate Round No. 1
anc2006

Pro

it seems my opponent escaped his first opportunity to start his argument, So i'll do it instead.

Many people mistake feminism with misandry, However it isn't equal. My side is pro-feminism, Not pro-misandry. The definition is clear:
FEMINISM:"the advocacy of women's rights on the basis of the equality of the sexes. "
MISANDRY:"dislike of, Contempt for, Or ingrained prejudice against men (i. E. The male sex). "

both groups of people may protest, But overall feminism still play the sane part. They just ask for equality and rights. Equality not absolute oligarchy. The things feminism may protest would be like:
"STOP Gender Pay Gap! "
"Girls Can Do This! "
these types of people protests in an assertive way. They just ask for the line being pushed back to the center, Not all the way to the other side. They protest on a basis of women being less rightful, And they most likely won't make up a random scenario that women is already superior at such fields.

on the other side, What we most likely to see, And what would be in the spotlight, And what whom wanted the spotlight on themselves, Are the misandrists. They are less sane and more aggressive. Being mistaken for feminists, They actually push the fault onto the true feminists.

such topics misandrists would argue are:
"Men are stupid"
"Girls should rule"
all these leads to superiority and sexism, Not anything "sane".

Notable feminists: (not necessarily, But they contribute to the women)
Marie Curie(scientist):first woman to win a Nobel Prize, The first person and only woman to win twice, And the only person to win a Nobel Prize in two different sciences. "

Hillary Clinton: Democratic Party's nominee for President of the United States in the 2016 election, The first woman nominated by a major party.

Rosa Parks:"American activist in the civil rights movement best known for her pivotal role in the Montgomery bus boycott. The United States Congress has called her "the first lady of civil rights" and "the mother of the freedom movement". "

Don't blame the fault of misandry to the feminism. These are 3( yes only 3) example of female empowerment and contribute against discrimination. What we see as misandrists discriminates, And are not equal to feminists. Feminists reduces discrimination.
screenjack

Con

So it isn't a "high ground" thing. You are the pro therefor it is up to you to make a claim. You see how it goes by rounds? If I actually made an argument in the first round I would've already been in the lead and you'd have to play catch up the whole time. I didn't take the easy win. You're welcome.

So I tend to agree with you're definition of feminism. I think if you frame feminism like that most people would call themselves feminists. It sounds to me like you should have asked to argue with a misandrists because most of your argument is geared towards clarifying a difference which is interesting and worth talking about but not what your title implies.

What your title implies is that you are part of a modern feminist movement that would support things like equity over equality. Women have the same rights as men in the U. S so for you to be promoting classic feminism isn't anything people take issue with. It is the status quo.

If you want to talk about the gender pay gap we can but it isn't a symptom of oppression. More women choose to go into fields that pay less. The difference between pay in each field is nominal. It's really a non-issue because we aren't going to force people into fields they don't want to do. We definitely aren't going to artificially inflate other fields for the sake of equity.

So the real question is still: what is your claim? As a modern feminist what change are you actually promoting?
Debate Round No. 2
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Debate Round No. 3
25 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by 1000lifetimes 2 years ago
1000lifetimes
The debate topic is exceedingly vague (1 word only).

Prior to forfeit, The only point that was made is that there needs to be a distinction between "feminists" and "mysandrists" (a term I was not familiar with). I think most people will agree that mysandrists (women who hate men while flying the "feminist" flag) are not to be taken seriously. But simply saying "feminists > mysandrists" doesn't accomplish much. The biggest question around feminism is "what is feminism/", And the mysandrist distinction doesn't answer it, It simply says "well, We're not man-haters". Okay, But WHAT ARE YOU THEN? !

Saying you're in favor of equality is also vague. Cherry-picking iconic successful and brilliant women from history also doesn't really accomplish much. Curie, Clinton and Parks, Are they feminists? Or just Women? And for every Marie Curie, There are likely at least a dozen women out there who post pro-feminism memes, That go out and try to hook up with an NFL running back at a bar and get pregnant by them.

It seems that every time a feminist speaks out, Someone asks them "I hear you, But what is it that you want? ! " and the answer is either some vague empty platitude, Or some pie-in-the-sky abstract idea, Or something absurd like demanding that office air-conditioning be shut off during the summer because it's sexist against women wanting to wear summer dresses to work, Or running away and not answering (or in this case, Forfeiting the debate).
Posted by jamontoast2 3 years ago
jamontoast2
@anc2006,

but if youre a "pro-feminist" then you believe that there is inequality happening still. So again, What rights do men have that women don't?
Posted by screenjack 3 years ago
screenjack
You do not show how woman are being oppressed or why I should support a modern feminist movement. Supporting the feminism you talk about is like supporting the civil rights movement. Most people already do and there isn't much to talk about. Where as new black activists groups like BLM make new claims. Claims that can be true or false and debated. Saying I'm anti BLM isn't the same as saying I'm anti-civilrights or anti black. So, Do you have a modern claim that woman are being oppressed? I would very much like to continue the debate I think it's a very successful bipartisan debate.
Posted by anc2006 3 years ago
anc2006
well i talk about feminism in general, Not just now.
Posted by jamontoast2 3 years ago
jamontoast2
just a question for @anc2006, What rights do men have that women don't?
Posted by screenjack 3 years ago
screenjack
You can defend feminism if you like but you're essentially defending the status quo. My point being that unless you have some kind of claim for modern feminism we're in agreement. You disavowed radical feminists and that's all I really wanted.
Posted by anc2006 3 years ago
anc2006
but that isn't a point. I just have the right to debate for feminism. Are you saying i don't qualify to argue for feminism?
Posted by screenjack 3 years ago
screenjack
ok we've gotten past the fact you disavow those feminists. I understand you don't call them feminists. What you're not understanding is that you aren't the figure head of feminism. When people think of feminism they don't think of you. Modern feminism is viewed as radical feminism because of bad pr. I think we might both agree on this. Now in a debate about modern feminism what are you promoting that isn't the status quo?
Posted by anc2006 3 years ago
anc2006
maybe you're not getting clear, But what i'm saying is that the feminists you are talking about isn't feminists even if they claim so.
Posted by screenjack 3 years ago
screenjack
you say that but I've got some pretty hilarious articles about people who claim to be feminists doing crazy stuff. You don't disavow the crazy and people will assume you are too. So I get why your making this debate but you should be making it with other modern feminists.
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