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Does the bible make sense?

MadCornishBiker
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3/27/2017 12:36:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/27/2017 2:09:14 AM, Harikrish wrote:
At 3/26/2017 10:46:02 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
At 3/26/2017 9:28:57 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Does the bible make sense?

Is the Pope Jewish?

I don't know. I know an atheist who tells me he is Jewish and I'm like, how is that even possible(?) He's looking at me like it's a stupid question and I'm pretty much thinking the same because how can you be Jewish and an atheist unless he married and atheist maybe. There might be some wiggle room there if God starts asking about it.

You should be surprised there aren't most Jews turning atheist after 1500 years of persecution and expulsion. If God picked a people that wouldn't quit on him he picked right when he picked the Jews. Too bad you are a holocaust denier.

Unfortunately he picked on the wrong people since they deserted him and his true worship centuries ago. That is why he let Israel disappear from the face of the earth centuries before Christ was born, and the current "Israel" is a fake.

The Jews have always proven to be as "stiff-necked" as the nation which spawned then, Israel. They refuse to accept their error, and refuse to accept the fulfilment of prophecies contained in their own word.

basically, as they have since Israel rejected their God from being king over them in the days of the prophet Samuel, continued to say to God "our way or no way". They even forced the Romans to put his only begotten son to death in his human form by blackmailing Pilate, threatening to cause him trouble with his masters in Rome, who were somewhat dubious about him anyway.

It's all there in their own scrolls, and yet they treat them as meaningless. How can they possibly believe that God could smile on them?

Despite Satan's attempts to pervert it, there is a truly modern day Israel on this earth, but it is not the one people thin of as a nation, it is now known as Jehovah's Witnesses.

The only thing the Jews have not quit on is trying to tell God what to do instead of doing what he wants them to.
It impossible to make a horse drink which is not thirsty, or eat if it is not hungry.

Likewise it is impossible to teach a person who does not wish to learn. Matthew 13:15.
MadCornishBiker
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3/27/2017 12:36:40 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/26/2017 9:28:57 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Does the bible make sense?

Is the Pope Jewish?

I never realised that, I always thought he was Catholic.
It impossible to make a horse drink which is not thirsty, or eat if it is not hungry.

Likewise it is impossible to teach a person who does not wish to learn. Matthew 13:15.
MadCornishBiker
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3/27/2017 12:40:41 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/26/2017 9:04:58 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 3/26/2017 5:59:00 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.

The simple answer is that to those of us who take the trouble to learn what it really says it is the most rational, logical, book ever written.

You call the Bibke the most rational logical book ever written because it has:
1. A Talking serpent that outwitted God
2. Trees created with the knowledge of good and evil before humans acquired that knowledge.
3. Trees created that made anyone eating it immortal.
4. Dead Jews offered atonement for sins. Jesus was a Jew that was offered as human sacrifice to atone for sins.
5. After you are baptized sexual immorality, adultery, child abandonment and other egregious sins are not sins any more. A different standard is applied called not guilty by reason of insanity.
6. Catholics are wrong in their beliefs . but sleeping with them is acceptable.

Again you show your almost total ignorance of what the Bible really tells us.

It is wrong enough that you distort what I have said about my past, but it will take much greater signs of repentance to get Jehovah to believe you have repented you continued blasphemy and lies.

You and Annanicole make very apt "bedfellows" you are both fond of twisting everything to your own ends, and trying, in effect, to tell God who he can and can't accept.

Are you sure you aren't a Jew? They have always done what you do.
It impossible to make a horse drink which is not thirsty, or eat if it is not hungry.

Likewise it is impossible to teach a person who does not wish to learn. Matthew 13:15.
Harikrish
Posts: 29,658
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3/27/2017 12:45:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/27/2017 12:36:01 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/27/2017 2:09:14 AM, Harikrish wrote:
At 3/26/2017 10:46:02 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
At 3/26/2017 9:28:57 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Does the bible make sense?

Is the Pope Jewish?

I don't know. I know an atheist who tells me he is Jewish and I'm like, how is that even possible(?) He's looking at me like it's a stupid question and I'm pretty much thinking the same because how can you be Jewish and an atheist unless he married and atheist maybe. There might be some wiggle room there if God starts asking about it.

You should be surprised there aren't most Jews turning atheist after 1500 years of persecution and expulsion. If God picked a people that wouldn't quit on him he picked right when he picked the Jews. Too bad you are a holocaust denier.

Unfortunately he picked on the wrong people since they deserted him and his true worship centuries ago. That is why he let Israel disappear from the face of the earth centuries before Christ was born, and the current "Israel" is a fake.

The Jews have always proven to be as "stiff-necked" as the nation which spawned then, Israel. They refuse to accept their error, and refuse to accept the fulfilment of prophecies contained in their own word.

basically, as they have since Israel rejected their God from being king over them in the days of the prophet Samuel, continued to say to God "our way or no way". They even forced the Romans to put his only begotten son to death in his human form by blackmailing Pilate, threatening to cause him trouble with his masters in Rome, who were somewhat dubious about him anyway.

It's all there in their own scrolls, and yet they treat them as meaningless. How can they possibly believe that God could smile on them?

Despite Satan's attempts to pervert it, there is a truly modern day Israel on this earth, but it is not the one people thin of as a nation, it is now known as Jehovah's Witnesses.

The only thing the Jews have not quit on is trying to tell God what to do instead of doing what he wants them to.

Look what you did with their religion. You used it to justify your 4 divorces,you used it to justify abandoning your 3 children, you got disfellowshipped and shunned when Jehovah's earthly organization found out how depraved you were. You used their religion to attract sexually immoral Filipino women. How much lower can you get?
Harikrish
Posts: 29,658
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3/27/2017 12:56:47 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/27/2017 12:40:41 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/26/2017 9:04:58 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 3/26/2017 5:59:00 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.

The simple answer is that to those of us who take the trouble to learn what it really says it is the most rational, logical, book ever written.

You call the Bible the most rational logical book ever written because it has:
1. A Talking serpent that outwitted God
2. Trees created with the knowledge of good and evil before humans acquired that knowledge.
3. Trees created that made anyone eating it immortal.
4. Dead Jews offered atonement for sins. Jesus was a Jew that was offered as human sacrifice to atone for sins.
5. After you are baptized sexual immorality, adultery, child abandonment and other egregious sins are not sins any more. A different standard is applied called not guilty by reason of insanity.
6. Catholics are wrong in their beliefs . but sleeping with them is acceptable.

Again you show your almost total ignorance of what the Bible really tells us.

The Bible tells us:
1. A Talking serpent that outwitted God.
2. Trees created with the knowledge of good and evil before humans acquired that knowledge.
3. Trees created that made anyone eating it immortal.
4. Dead Jews offered atonement for sins. Jesus was a Jew that was offered as human sacrifice to atone for sins.
5. After you are baptized sexual immorality, adultery, child abandonment and other egregious sins are not sins any more. A different standard is applied called not guilty by reason of insanity.
6. Catholics are wrong in their beliefs . but sleeping with them is acceptable.

It is wrong enough that you distort what I have said about my past, but it will take much greater signs of repentance to get Jehovah to believe you have repented you continued blasphemy and lies.

You have not pointed to any distortions in my posts about you because I have quoted you in your own words.

Try to deny the links:

http://www.debate.org...

Actually it will be my 5th marriage and my 4th wife, but that has no bearing on what God's word tells us marriage is.
---
Allan Moore attacking Imelda after she dumped him.

He wrote: As her sister and cousins say, Imelda is always short of money, but she chose that life when she cheated on me. Now she must live it.

I have already had one "proposal" from one of her relatives, who says she is keen to marry me and make up for what Imelda did.
https://www.debate.org...

History of Allan Moore's broken marriages under the name Madcornishbiker.
http://www.debate.org...

Allan Moore (Madcornishbiker) indulged in oral and anal sex.
http://www.religionforums.org...

Summary of Allan Moore's (Madcornishbiker) lies.
https://www.debate.org...

Allan Moore (Madcornishbiker) confessing he has mental problems and an under developed brain.
http://www.theforumsite.com...

You and Annanicole make very apt "bedfellows" you are both fond of twisting everything to your own ends, and trying, in effect, to tell God who he can and can't accept.

Are you sure you aren't a Jew? They have always done what you do.
bulproof
Posts: 36,669
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3/27/2017 2:32:42 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/26/2017 5:59:00 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
The simple answer is that to those of us who take the trouble to learn what it really says it is the most rational, logical, book ever written.
In the words of Hari:
A Talking serpent that outwitted God.
YOU can't get more rational and logical than that.
Skeptical1
Posts: 1,758
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3/27/2017 8:12:50 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/27/2017 12:36:40 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/26/2017 9:28:57 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Does the bible make sense?

Is the Pope Jewish?

I never realised that, I always thought he was Catholic.

Exactly.
Ethang5: Children cannot be morons.
Skeptical1: The only thing you have demonstrated is they don't have a monopoly on it.
12_13
Posts: 2,575
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3/27/2017 9:24:29 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/26/2017 4:12:50 PM, Harikrish wrote:
God did not live in the Garden with Adm nod Eve. He gave them instructions and left.
But he did put the knowledge of good and evil into a tree.

Genesis 2:16-17, "And the LORD God commanded the man, "You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die.""

No wonder if you are lost when you add so much own meanings to Bible scriptures.

That scripture doesn"t say the knowledge was put into that tree. By eating the fruit, they could get the knowledge, because then they see what it means to be without God.

And what they did was acquire the knowledge of good and evil. The bible is full of attempts by God to teach man the difference between good and evil. He even sent prophets and his own son Jesus to teach man what was good and what was evil. But Adam and Eve having been punished by God for acquiring the knowledge of good and evil created a genetic revulsion and avoidance for such knowledge. Any wonder why the Jews resisted the prophets and Jesus because they saw this as another trap to force them to learn what was good and evil only to be punished again like Adam and Eve.

Bible says the reason why Jesus came was this:

"The Spirit of the Lord is on me, Because he has anointed me to preach good news to the poor. He has sent me to heal the brokenhearted, To proclaim release to the captives, Recovering of sight to the blind, To deliver those who are crushed, And to proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord."
Luke 4:18-19

I rather believe what the Bible tells than you.

The bible has failed scientific scrutiny. Archeological discoveries demolishes the Bible proving the characters in the bible were fictional character. There was no Exodus. The kingdom of David and Solomon was just some tiny little cow town. Even Jesus was a deluded Jewish rabbi who was crucified by the Romans.

And you believe that because you say so and everything you say must be true because you says so?
Harikrish
Posts: 29,658
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3/28/2017 1:32:24 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/27/2017 9:24:29 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/26/2017 4:12:50 PM, Harikrish wrote:
God did not live in the Garden with Adm nod Eve. He gave them instructions and left.
But he did put the knowledge of good and evil into a tree.

Genesis 2:16-17, "And the LORD God commanded the man, "You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die.""

No wonder if you are lost when you add so much own meanings to Bible scriptures.

That was straight from the Bible. God warns Adam not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

That scripture doesn"t say the knowledge was put into that tree. By eating the fruit, they could get the knowledge, because then they see what it means to be without God.

The knowledge of good and evil was put in the tree. God warns Adam not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil because it would end his innocence. He would become like God knowing good and evil. That is exactly what happened.

Genesis 3: 22 And the Lord God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever." 23 So the Lord God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken. 24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side[e] of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.

If you knew your scriptures you would know eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil was how tge became like Gid knowing good and evil.

Genesis 3:

The Fall
3 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, "You must not eat from any tree in the garden"?"

2 The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, "You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.""

4 "You will not certainly die," the serpent said to the woman. 5 "For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it. 7 Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they realized they were naked; so they sewed fig leaves together and made coverings for themselves.

And what they did was acquire the knowledge of good and evil. The bible is full of attempts by God to teach man the difference between good and evil. He even sent prophets and his own son Jesus to teach man what was good and what was evil. But Adam and Eve having been punished by God for acquiring the knowledge of good and evil created a genetic revulsion and avoidance for such knowledge. Any wonder why the Jews resisted the prophets and Jesus because they saw this as another trap to force them to learn what was good and evil only to be punished again like Adam and Eve.

Bible says the reason why Jesus came was this:

"The Spirit of the Lord is on me, Because he has anointed me to preach good news to the poor. He has sent me to heal the brokenhearted, To proclaim release to the captives, Recovering of sight to the blind, To deliver those who are crushed, And to proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord."
Luke 4:18-19

But we know that was not what the people were threatening Jesus with stoning for. Jesus was also making blasphemous claims.

John 10:33 "We are not stoning you for any good work," they replied, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."
I rather believe what the Bible tells than you.

The bible has failed scientific scrutiny. Archeological discoveries demolishes the Bible proving the characters in the bible were fictional character. There was no Exodus. The kingdom of David and Solomon was just some tiny little cow town. Even Jesus was a deluded Jewish rabbi who was crucified by the Romans.

And you believe that because you say so and everything you say must be true because you says so?
Most biblical scholars agree what over time has proven to be sound exegesis and hermeneutics. I am just presenting what biblical scholars agree are contradictions that are resolved by other fields like archeology and historical context.
Composer
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3/28/2017 1:47:36 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Gen. 3: 2 The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, "You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.""

Where does Story book God(s) say " you must not touch it? ".

:)
Face-of-the-deep
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3/28/2017 1:24:48 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
The knowledge of good and evil was put in the tree. God warns Adam not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil because it would end his innocence. He would become like God knowing good and evil. That is exactly what happened.

Genesis 3: 22 And the Lord God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

When you quote the Bible you need to quote what it says.-->"Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil; and now, lest he stretch out his hand, and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever"<--It really is futile when not being able to read. (lest) means unless. The Bible says:"Unless he reach out his hand...".
Harikrish
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3/28/2017 1:38:42 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/28/2017 1:24:48 PM, Face-of-the-deep wrote:
The knowledge of good and evil was put in the tree. God warns Adam not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil because it would end his innocence. He would become like God knowing good and evil. That is exactly what happened.

Genesis 3: 22 And the Lord God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

When you quote the Bible you need to quote what it says.-->"Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil; and now, lest he stretch out his hand, and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever"<--It really is futile when not being able to read. (lest) means unless. The Bible says:"Unless he reach out his hand...".

The futility is in your attempt to reach beyond your grasp. You try to act scholarly lest your advanced senility will betray you.

Definition of lest
for fear that "often used after an expression denoting fear or apprehension worried lest she should be late hesitant to speak out lest he be fired.

Get an education you old fart before you try to correct biblical scholars like Harikrish.
12_13
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3/28/2017 8:24:17 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/28/2017 1:32:24 AM, Harikrish wrote:
But we know that was not what the people were threatening Jesus with stoning for. Jesus was also making blasphemous claims.

John 10:33 "We are not stoning you for any good work," they replied, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."

But Jesus didn"t claim to be God. Jesus said God is greater than him and there is only one true God. So he was falsely accused and judged.

This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
John 17:3

You heard how I told you, 'I go away, and I come to you.' If you loved me, you would have rejoiced, because I said 'I am going to my Father;' for the Father is greater than I.
John 14:28

Most biblical scholars agree what over time has proven to be sound exegesis and hermeneutics. I am just presenting what biblical scholars agree are contradictions that are resolved by other fields like archeology and historical context.

Ok, sorry, I don"t believe things just because some scholars say so. :)
Harikrish
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3/28/2017 9:20:50 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/28/2017 8:24:17 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/28/2017 1:32:24 AM, Harikrish wrote:
But we know that was not what the people were threatening Jesus with stoning for. Jesus was also making blasphemous claims.

John 10:33 "We are not stoning you for any good work," they replied, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."

But Jesus didn"t claim to be God. Jesus said God is greater than him and there is only one true God. So he was falsely accused and judged.

This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
John 17:3

You heard how I told you, 'I go away, and I come to you.' If you loved me, you would have rejoiced, because I said 'I am going to my Father;' for the Father is greater than I.
John 14:28

Most biblical scholars agree what over time has proven to be sound exegesis and hermeneutics. I am just presenting what biblical scholars agree are contradictions that are resolved by other fields like archeology and historical context.

Ok, sorry, I don"t believe things just because some scholars say so. :)

So you don't believe anyone who is a scholar or better educated than you. Is that how you managed to successfully remain stuck on stupid?
bulproof
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3/29/2017 12:45:46 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/28/2017 8:24:17 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/28/2017 1:32:24 AM, Harikrish wrote:
But we know that was not what the people were threatening Jesus with stoning for. Jesus was also making blasphemous claims.

John 10:33 "We are not stoning you for any good work," they replied, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."

But Jesus didn"t claim to be God. Jesus said God is greater than him and there is only one true God. So he was falsely accused and judged.

This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
John 17:3

You heard how I told you, 'I go away, and I come to you.' If you loved me, you would have rejoiced, because I said 'I am going to my Father;' for the Father is greater than I.
John 14:28

Most biblical scholars agree what over time has proven to be sound exegesis and hermeneutics. I am just presenting what biblical scholars agree are contradictions that are resolved by other fields like archeology and historical context.

Ok, sorry, I don"t believe things just because some scholars say so. :)
That's right, you believe things because some long dead ignorant goatherd says so.
Harikrish
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3/29/2017 1:26:39 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/29/2017 12:45:46 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/28/2017 8:24:17 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/28/2017 1:32:24 AM, Harikrish wrote:
But we know that was not what the people were threatening Jesus with stoning for. Jesus was also making blasphemous claims.

John 10:33 "We are not stoning you for any good work," they replied, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."

But Jesus didn"t claim to be God. Jesus said God is greater than him and there is only one true God. So he was falsely accused and judged.

This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
John 17:3

You heard how I told you, 'I go away, and I come to you.' If you loved me, you would have rejoiced, because I said 'I am going to my Father;' for the Father is greater than I.
John 14:28

Most biblical scholars agree what over time has proven to be sound exegesis and hermeneutics. I am just presenting what biblical scholars agree are contradictions that are resolved by other fields like archeology and historical context.

Ok, sorry, I don"t believe things just because some scholars say so. :)
That's right, you believe things because some long dead ignorant goatherd says so.

I think Jesus was a carpenter's son. He wouldn't qualify as a goatherd.
Perussi
Posts: 3,687
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3/29/2017 2:57:07 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

He didn't have what he wanted, he had two humans who had sinned.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.
bulproof
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3/29/2017 4:08:57 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/29/2017 1:26:39 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 3/29/2017 12:45:46 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/28/2017 8:24:17 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/28/2017 1:32:24 AM, Harikrish wrote:
But we know that was not what the people were threatening Jesus with stoning for. Jesus was also making blasphemous claims.

John 10:33 "We are not stoning you for any good work," they replied, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."

But Jesus didn"t claim to be God. Jesus said God is greater than him and there is only one true God. So he was falsely accused and judged.

This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
John 17:3

You heard how I told you, 'I go away, and I come to you.' If you loved me, you would have rejoiced, because I said 'I am going to my Father;' for the Father is greater than I.
John 14:28

Most biblical scholars agree what over time has proven to be sound exegesis and hermeneutics. I am just presenting what biblical scholars agree are contradictions that are resolved by other fields like archeology and historical context.

Ok, sorry, I don"t believe things just because some scholars say so. :)
That's right, you believe things because some long dead ignorant goatherd says so.

I think Jesus was a carpenter's son. He wouldn't qualify as a goatherd.
I've never read anything this mythical person has ever said.
Harikrish
Posts: 29,658
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3/29/2017 4:14:52 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/29/2017 2:57:07 PM, Perussi wrote:
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

He didn't have what he wanted, he had two humans who had sinned.

It is only a sin if the two knew what they were doing was wrong. They had no concept of good and evil before they ate the fruit.

Note God said if they ate the fruit they would die. But they didn't have the concept of death either because they were the first human creation.

So God punished Adam and Eve based on his morality of good and evil. But he had not given Adam and Eve that knowledge. He put that knowledge of good and evil in a tree instead.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.
Perussi
Posts: 3,687
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3/29/2017 5:02:04 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

He didn't have what he wanted, he had two humans who had sinned.

It is only a sin if the two knew what they were doing was wrong. They had no concept of good and evil before they ate the fruit.

God said in short "hey, see this? do not eat it". They understood language and were commandable, god even said to name the animals. They weren't idiots. They could understand the concept of good and bad.

Note God said if they ate the fruit they would die. But they didn't have the concept of death either because they were the first human creation.

God wouldn't say if you eat this you will die if they didn't understand "die".

So God punished Adam and Eve based on his morality of good and evil. But he had not given Adam and Eve that knowledge. He put that knowledge of good and evil in a tree instead.
Harikrish
Posts: 29,658
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3/29/2017 6:10:21 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/29/2017 5:02:04 PM, Perussi wrote:
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

He didn't have what he wanted, he had two humans who had sinned.

It is only a sin if the two knew what they were doing was wrong. They had no concept of good and evil before they ate the fruit.

God said in short "hey, see this? do not eat it". They understood language and were commandable, god even said to name the animals. They weren't idiots. They could understand the concept of good and bad.

Here is what scriptures tell us.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

They were told they would die if they ate the fruit. But Adam and Eve did not know what death was. They were the first created humans.

Note God said if they ate the fruit they would die. But they didn't have the concept of death either because they were the first human creation.

God wouldn't say if you eat this you will die if they didn't understand "die".

They were living in the Garen of Eden where no death was possible or had ever occurred. It even had the tree of life to grant immorality.

So God punished Adam and Eve based on his morality of good and evil. But he had not given Adam and Eve that knowledge. He put that knowledge of good and evil in a tree instead.
Perussi
Posts: 3,687
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3/29/2017 7:08:28 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
God either taught them to speak or created them knowing how to speak. Either way they knew what it meant. You don't have to experience or view death to be explained to what it is.
12_13
Posts: 2,575
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3/29/2017 7:20:54 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/28/2017 9:20:50 PM, Harikrish wrote:
Ok, sorry, I don"t believe things just because some scholars say so. :)

So you don't believe anyone who is a scholar or better educated than you. Is that how you managed to successfully remain stuck on stupid?

I said "I don"t believe things just because some scholars say so". And it means, things are not truth for me because it is said by scholar. The title of person is not any reason for me to believe something. I believe things, if they are well reasoned or proved.
Harikrish
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3/29/2017 8:27:27 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/29/2017 5:02:04 PM, Perussi wrote:
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

He didn't have what he wanted, he had two humans who had sinned.

It is only a sin if the two knew what they were doing was wrong. They had no concept of good and evil before they ate the fruit.

God said in short "hey, see this? do not eat it". They understood language and were commandable, god even said to name the animals. They weren't idiots. They could understand the concept of good and bad.

How many animal nanes are found in Bible named by Adam? Adam couldn't even follow a simple order like don't eat the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Note God said if they ate the fruit they would die. But they didn't have the concept of death either because they were the first human creation.

God wouldn't say if you eat this you will die if they didn't understand "die".

They were living in the Garden of Eden where no death was possible or had ever occurred. It even had the tree of life to grant immorality. Remember they were the first humans created.

So God punished Adam and Eve based on his morality of good and evil. But he had not given Adam and Eve that knowledge. He put that knowledge of good and evil in a tree instead.
Harikrish
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3/29/2017 8:31:19 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/29/2017 7:08:28 PM, Perussi wrote:
God either taught them to speak or created them knowing how to speak. Either way they knew what it meant. You don't have to experience or view death to be explained to what it is.

Most people don't know what death is even today. Is it the final resting place? Is death the beginning of the after life? What about the cycle of rebirths? What about entering Paradise upon death? Death is very abstract.
Perussi
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3/29/2017 8:33:26 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/29/2017 8:27:27 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 3/29/2017 5:02:04 PM, Perussi wrote:
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

He didn't have what he wanted, he had two humans who had sinned.

It is only a sin if the two knew what they were doing was wrong. They had no concept of good and evil before they ate the fruit.

God said in short "hey, see this? do not eat it". They understood language and were commandable, god even said to name the animals. They weren't idiots. They could understand the concept of good and bad.

How many animal nanes are found in Bible named by Adam? Adam couldn't even follow a simple order like don't eat the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

The bible isn't going to say what he named them, just that he did. He didn't follow it because he failed to not sin. He just failed. I can create complex formulas and i can still sin.

Note God said if they ate the fruit they would die. But they didn't have the concept of death either because they were the first human creation.

God wouldn't say if you eat this you will die if they didn't understand "die".

They were living in the Garden of Eden where no death was possible or had ever occurred. It even had the tree of life to grant immorality. Remember they were the first humans created.

Stop repeating that, that argument has fallen.
MadCornishBiker
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3/29/2017 8:33:33 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/29/2017 7:08:28 PM, Perussi wrote:
God either taught them to speak or created them knowing how to speak. Either way they knew what it meant. You don't have to experience or view death to be explained to what it is.

Or the listeners simply thought they were speaking, when in fact the "voices" were simply appearance in their heads without bothering their ears.
It impossible to make a horse drink which is not thirsty, or eat if it is not hungry.

Likewise it is impossible to teach a person who does not wish to learn. Matthew 13:15.
Perussi
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3/29/2017 8:35:22 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/29/2017 8:31:19 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 3/29/2017 7:08:28 PM, Perussi wrote:
God either taught them to speak or created them knowing how to speak. Either way they knew what it meant. You don't have to experience or view death to be explained to what it is.

Most people don't know what death is even today. Is it the final resting place? Is death the beginning of the after life? What about the cycle of rebirths? What about entering Paradise upon death? Death is very abstract.

Death is when something dies. What you carry it to is afterlife skepticalness.
MadCornishBiker
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3/29/2017 8:37:23 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/27/2017 8:12:50 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
At 3/27/2017 12:36:40 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/26/2017 9:28:57 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Does the bible make sense?

Is the Pope Jewish?

I never realised that, I always thought he was Catholic.

Exactly.

But the Bible makes perfect sense if you read it properly.

And yes I do recognize sarcasm when I read it. Do you?
It impossible to make a horse drink which is not thirsty, or eat if it is not hungry.

Likewise it is impossible to teach a person who does not wish to learn. Matthew 13:15.
Harikrish
Posts: 29,658
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3/29/2017 8:38:30 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/29/2017 7:20:54 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/28/2017 9:20:50 PM, Harikrish wrote:
Ok, sorry, I don"t believe things just because some scholars say so. :)

So you don't believe anyone who is a scholar or better educated than you. Is that how you managed to successfully remain stuck on stupid?

I said "I don"t believe things just because some scholars say so". And it means, things are not truth for me because it is said by scholar. The title of person is not any reason for me to believe something. I believe things, if they are well reasoned or proved.

And why do you think what a scholar applies in not reasoned or proven?.

Scholarship: learning; knowledge acquired by study; the academic attainments of a scholar

Scholar: a specialist in a particular branch of study, especially the humanities; a distinguished academic.

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